Jennifer Schuler, CEO of Handel’s Homemade Ice Cream, joins Zack Oates to break down what guest experience really means in a fast, tech-driven world. Drawing from her time leading Wetzel’s Pretzels and now scaling an 80-plus-year ice cream brand, she focuses on something simple but often overlooked: people want to feel seen.

Micro Connections Matter (02:19)

“I think it’s those micro connections… that little personal touch.”

Jennifer explains that small, human moments create the strongest memories. A simple gesture like writing a name or acknowledging a guest can outweigh everything else in the experience.

Why She Chose Handel’s (03:26)

“I was really craving something where you could make that type of connection happen in your community.”

After leaving Wetzel’s, Jennifer looked for a brand that combined scale with emotional impact. Handel’s stood out because it already played a role in people’s celebrations and everyday moments.

Technology vs Human Connection (06:33)

“People are overly tempted to use technology to cut costs and put something between them and the guest.”

She makes it clear that while tools like AI can improve accuracy, they should never replace connection. The risk is creating efficiency at the cost of experience.

Hustle Then Slow Down (07:12)

“You have to hustle behind the scenes… and then when you get to the guest, slow down.”

Jennifer describes guest interaction as a shift in pace. Speed drives operations, but connection requires intention in the moment that actually matters.

Hire for Hospitality (12:13)

“We can train for skill, but not for that wiring.”

At Handel’s, hiring focuses on people who naturally care about others. Technical skills can be taught, but genuine hospitality cannot.

Product Still Comes First (05:55)

“Foundationally, you’ve got to have your product right.”

Even with strong hospitality, none of it works without a great product. Handel’s commitment to making ice cream from scratch is the base that everything else builds on.

Links:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/schulerjennifer/

https://www.linkedin.com/company/handels-ice-cream/about/

https://handelsicecream.com/

Transcript

00:00:00:12 – 00:00:25:10

Zack Oates

Welcome to another edition of Give an Ovation, the Restaurant guest Experience podcast. I’m your host, Zack Oates, and each week, I get to chat with industry experts to uncover their strategies and tactics to help you create a five star guest experience. This podcast is powered by ovation, the AI feedback and operations platform built for multi-unit restaurants. Learn what’s actually happening in your restaurant and exactly how to improve while driving revenue.

00:00:25:11 – 00:00:52:08

Zack Oates

Learn more at Ovation Up .com. and today we have Jennifer Schuler. If you don’t know her, she is a titan of the industry. She was the CEO of Wetzel’s Pretzels and now she’s the CEO of handles. We have a mutual mentor in Bill Phelps. Dear friend and someone who’s just been doing incredible things. And I never had the privilege of working with him directly, only like working with him as the customer and as friends with Jennifer.

00:00:52:08 – 00:01:02:17

Zack Oates

I had the privilege of working directly with him a wetzel’s. And so anyway, I’m excited, Jennifer, because not only have you had a great education, Harvard Business School, but also Stanford.

00:01:02:17 – 00:01:02:23

Jennifer Schuler

What do.

00:01:02:23 – 00:01:14:05

Zack Oates

They say? They say Stanford. Oh, I said Harvard. Oh my gosh. There’s some alumni network that’s going to be mad at me.

00:01:14:07 – 00:01:15:21

Jennifer Schuler

That’s all right. That’s all right. I’ll take you there.

00:01:15:22 – 00:01:34:14

Zack Oates

Yeah. Ford. They’re both pretty good, though. I mean, not I’d take either. Yeah. Anyway, but you’ve had some great hands on education as well. So Jennifer, I’m so excited to get your take on this. And first of all, I just love to jump in and be like, when you were looking to move on from Wetzel’s, what was it that attracted you about handles?

00:01:34:17 – 00:01:55:07

Jennifer Schuler

Yeah, sure. It’s a great question and I’ll give you a little story about it too. So after my experience at Wetzel’s worked with Bill there, and I spent about a decade there, and I just thought, like, I could never find a better job than this. I think, you know, the culture was phenomenal. We had kind of unlocked some new growth in the business that was unexpected.

00:01:55:07 – 00:02:19:24

Jennifer Schuler

And, you know, pretzels were just fun. And so I took a year off. And in that time, one of the things I noticed was how allergic I felt to anything digital and how much I craved in-person experiences. And I think even now, in this world of AI, AI is going to do amazing things for us. And I think it’s also going to make people crave those in-person connections even more.

00:02:19:24 – 00:02:39:20

Jennifer Schuler

And there’s a lot of research that shows restaurants do that for people. It’s those micro connections. It’s the reason Starbucks is using a Sharpie to write your name on a cup, again, because it’s that little personal micro connection type of touch. I was grabbing a sandwich the other day by my office, and the guy saw my handle shirt, and I asked them what I did and I told this handles.

00:02:39:20 – 00:02:55:09

Jennifer Schuler

I said, I have to take this call. When I come back, I’ll get my sandwich and I came back. He had written my name on the sandwich in an ice cream cone. Oh, and I just stopped. And I at the end of the day, I was like, what’s the best part of my day? I was like, it was when the guy from the sandwich shop saw me and put an ice cream cone on my bag.

00:02:55:09 – 00:03:26:06

Jennifer Schuler

Just those little micro connections. I think you’re going to matter even more. And so, going back to my decision, I was really craving something where you could make that type of connections happen in your community. And I will remember it so vividly because that was the soft side. On the harder side, I was looking for a brand I thought had potential to scale and be a national brand, and had white space to grow, because I think what I do best is capitalizing that, building momentum around it, building a team to capitalize on it.

00:03:26:08 – 00:03:42:18

Jennifer Schuler

And so I remember I’d been about not quite a year into the sabbatical, and it was on a Tuesday. And I thought to myself, okay, like what brands are out there that fit that for me? And the one that came in my mind immediately, like was handles right down the road for my house. The number one store in the country is here.

00:03:42:18 – 00:04:02:00

Jennifer Schuler

They do a fabulous job of making it intentional point of connection with the guests, and it’s the place we go to celebrate any amazing thing that’s happening in the family. Like we won the game to cushion any blow. You know, like I got rejected, you know, I didn’t get into this, whatever that is. That’s what we go to handles to do that.

00:04:02:02 – 00:04:13:05

Jennifer Schuler

And so that’s the brand that popped in my mind on a Tuesday. And literally two days later, a recruiter called me and said, they’re searching for a CEO and wondered if you would be interested. Wow. So my search is pretty narrow.

00:04:13:05 – 00:04:14:21

Zack Oates

But synchronicity right there, right?

00:04:14:23 – 00:04:26:20

Jennifer Schuler

Exactly, exactly. But I think because I was really clear on what it was that I was looking for in the impact I was trying to make, both professionally and purposefully in communities. So it felt like a really good fit for me.

00:04:26:22 – 00:04:41:14

Zack Oates

That’s awesome. And I think that really like the whole concept of ice cream. I love that point of like it softens the blow, but it’s a it’s a celebration, right? It’s like, hey, I had a tough day. Let’s go to handles. It’s like, hey, we had a great day. Let’s go to handles. It’s like, hey, it’s a Thursday.

00:04:41:16 – 00:04:51:11

Zack Oates

Let’s go to handles. There’s just the occasions of that outside of breakfast are pretty big right. Yeah I think if you go into handles for breakfast, it’s Yeah. You made me.

00:04:51:11 – 00:04:57:09

Jennifer Schuler

Think of going for breakfast. The senior citizen group, because they’ve been up five in the morning, so like 11 last.

00:04:57:09 – 00:04:57:18

Zack Oates

Time.

00:04:57:22 – 00:05:03:19

Jennifer Schuler

Before. It’s time for ice cream. And it’s like protein and calcium dense. They need the calories like.

00:05:03:21 – 00:05:09:21

Zack Oates

We really do. And we do have we actually have like a decent breakfast day part like a morning. Oh okay.

00:05:09:22 – 00:05:15:07

Jennifer Schuler

No we know it’s pretty slow, but we do have a core demographic that we see comes at that time. Yeah.

00:05:15:07 – 00:05:36:07

Zack Oates

Wow. Okay. That’s impressive. Not something I would have expected, but I love that you think about those guests because it is about all the guests. And so as you think about guest experience, what do you think are some of the most important aspects of guest experience nowadays? And maybe kind of phrased a little differently, like, what do you think other restaurants get wrong when they think about the guests?

00:05:36:07 – 00:05:55:10

Jennifer Schuler

Oh yeah, totally, I think so. Like by way of background or booking handles, 80 year old 80 plus year old brand, we make ice cream from scratch in store. So I think first and foremost, our product is kind of best in class. Like there’s no other ice cream player that’s doing it at our scale 150 flavors, 48 available every day, made from scratch and store.

00:05:55:10 – 00:05:58:20

Jennifer Schuler

So foundationally, you got to have your product, right.

00:05:58:20 – 00:06:04:14

Zack Oates

So by the way, I will say, as someone who is allergic to milk, great vegan options as well.

00:06:04:19 – 00:06:33:16

Jennifer Schuler

Oh good. I’m glad more coming. We’ve got a line coming this summer because we’ve got a lot of fruit vegan options that vegans need creamy stuff too. So we’ve got some like creamy peanut butter and chocolaty options coming this summer. So getting our feet. So I think like foundationally the exceptional products experience, you can’t leapfrog over that. But I think on the guest side, I think people are overly tempted to use technology to cut costs and put something between them and the guest.

00:06:33:18 – 00:06:52:20

Jennifer Schuler

And there are times where I think technology will be incredibly helpful, like AI, to ensure that orders on the Dry here are made with accuracy. Great. Like double check it like this. Accuracy is the number one customer complaint. You can use AI tests to address that. But people I was saying earlier like they crave those point of connections.

00:06:52:20 – 00:07:12:04

Jennifer Schuler

People want to be seen. And in a restaurant industry you’re going so fast to service, like in quick, like I got a minute or less to serve this customer to align this one, whatever that is, you have to be able to like hustle, hustle, hustle, hustle behind the scenes. And then when you get to the guest slowdown, it’s like a better production.

00:07:12:04 – 00:07:28:04

Jennifer Schuler

Like everything’s moving fast and quickly, but when you come here, like, that’s your moment to like, pause, connect, find a reason to make that moment last a little bit longer. I think people underestimate how much people will value that.

00:07:28:06 – 00:07:32:22

Zack Oates

Well, I think right behind me here I have that the book unreasonable.

00:07:32:24 – 00:07:37:02

Jennifer Schuler

Okay. Wait, do I have my year I okay, I’ve been reading the same book. I think it’s fantastic.

00:07:37:03 – 00:07:41:14

Zack Oates

But for those who are listening that don’t know what just happened.

00:07:41:16 – 00:08:03:22

Zack Oates

Let me say I moved my head and I showed that I have will get there is unreasonable hospitality right behind me. And what an incredible book. And I think that one of the things he talks about and he shared this when he came on the podcast as well, is that, for example, like your financials, most of it needs to be completely strict, and then you have that little percentage that you just do whatever you want with, right?

00:08:03:24 – 00:08:24:23

Jennifer Schuler

We totally do that. Yes, I love that because in foodservice there’s this ethos of like, pinch every penny because it’s low margin and you have to and that is right. But what he says exactly that, like pinch all those pennies behind the scenes that in places that don’t matter, they don’t care about so that you have dollars to throw out of guest to make that experience memorable.

00:08:24:23 – 00:08:45:11

Jennifer Schuler

And they did it in a fine dining experience. So they would, you know, like create a snow day for someone who is coming in from Florida. I think we can do it. And you know, there’s other ways you can apply it to more of a quick serve restaurant. But I think you’re exactly right, Zach. And I think it’s very important to distinguish those things, because even in my own organization, people are like, oh, but we have to be cost conscious.

00:08:45:12 – 00:08:51:18

Jennifer Schuler

I’m like, yeah, 90% of the time, and 10% of the time you have to be wild. Well, what?

00:08:51:20 – 00:09:00:04

Zack Oates

But kind of what you’re talking about, though, is not only on the financial side, but also on the emotional side, right. And on like the prep side, where. Oh, yes.

00:09:00:10 – 00:09:00:16

Jennifer Schuler

Inducing.

00:09:00:18 – 00:09:19:00

Zack Oates

Things. Right. Like you go 95% so hard, so focused, so diligent. But you know, because you’re not always dealing with guess there’s a lot of prep, there’s a lot of back have house things that need to get set up. But then to your point of like take that 510% when you were there with the guests, slow down, look them in the eyes.

00:09:19:00 – 00:09:28:14

Zack Oates

I think that’s so powerful to use that same concept, because at the end of the day, we’re all trying to make guests feel special, right? Yeah. And they should. Yeah. Feel seen.

00:09:28:16 – 00:09:44:03

Jennifer Schuler

Yeah. That’s a really powerful connection you’re making. Zach know between because dollars are a resource and time is a resource. Yeah. Because you think about time as that resource that’s constrained. How do you apply the same thing that I really like. You given me a really.

00:09:44:03 – 00:09:47:20

Zack Oates

Cool I mean, you said it, Jennifer. I was just repeated it. Yeah.

00:09:47:22 – 00:09:50:08

Jennifer Schuler

I like the way you like the week summarized it. Yeah.

00:09:50:13 – 00:10:08:11

Zack Oates

But that’s a thing where when people we talk about the last mile and at the end of the day, if you think about that counter that, that three foot counter, it’s really not about the last mile, but it’s about the last three feet because it’s not about getting someone the right food at the right time, at the right time.

00:10:08:15 – 00:10:10:16

Zack Oates

It’s about how they feel about it. Right? Yeah.

00:10:10:18 – 00:10:18:01

Jennifer Schuler

Yeah. You have to do the other stuff. Like you need the right, you the right. Like without that, it’s that people don’t matter. Yeah, right. Yeah.

00:10:18:03 – 00:10:36:19

Zack Oates

I often think about when my good friends, she lives in Brooklyn and there were two coffee shops, one that was closer. That was good, and one that was a little bit farther. That was great. And so it was like she said, which one did I go to? Oh, sorry. It was closer and great and further and good. I was like, obviously the one that was closer and great.

00:10:36:19 – 00:10:57:00

Zack Oates

And she goes, I went to the one where they knew my name, and that was like such an moment for me of that’s really what hospitality is, right? Wow. Yeah. And so when you think about handles and you think about how to create that guest experience, are there any tactics that you’ve implemented or even a wetzel’s? Because both are kind of you don’t have a lot of time.

00:10:57:03 – 00:11:02:14

Zack Oates

Yeah, it’s your guest. And so, yeah. What are some tactics that you’ve used to help create a better guest experience.

00:11:02:16 – 00:11:25:02

Jennifer Schuler

Yeah, I think there’s some things about ice cream that naturally lend to it. So for example, because we’re making ice cream from scratch coming in the morning, we’re selling what what’s got sold through. We’re looking at the season and saying, oh, it’s time to bring out the peach line. In the morning you’re prepping, then your ice cream is sitting overnight, you’re serving it the next day and you’re scooping and going.

00:11:25:02 – 00:11:51:05

Jennifer Schuler

And so it’s it’s different dynamically. Then I think what happens in a burger or a chicken place where you are frying to order and like it’s just a little harder in that environment to do it. I think we spent time with our friend. I think we’re a franchise organization, so we spend time when we’re bringing in franchise partners to see that are those people who just really delight in it, like who naturally enjoy it, who are drawn to it.

00:11:51:07 – 00:12:13:05

Jennifer Schuler

And in fact, that’s even more important. Like, we can teach you ice cream making, but if you’re not naturally drawn to how to delight a guest, then it’s going to be hard to teach you that part. We can train for skill, but not for that wiring. And I remember the other day we were interviewing a potential franchise partner and he had run, pizza restaurant.

00:12:13:05 – 00:12:33:17

Jennifer Schuler

And so I said, you know, like, tell me about a time where you stepped up to make a guest feel, like, special and seen. And he told me the most compelling story of a gentleman who came in and looked kind of off kilter and just, like, kind of not in a good headspace. And he got him his pizza and sat down with him.

00:12:33:17 – 00:12:53:04

Jennifer Schuler

And ultimately, like, the police came in and escorted this gentleman away. And it turned out he was having some sort of like mental health psychosis and had like left the house or whatever. And three months later, the wife came in and tried to pay for the pizza and like gave him like $50. He’s like, you do not owe me anything.

00:12:53:04 – 00:13:14:17

Jennifer Schuler

And she’s like, you were with my husband in the moment, in need. Like you saw him, you sat with him. You spent the time to do that. I’m just, like, so deeply grateful for that. And that’s just wiring, right? Like someone who’s wired to see someone hurting and stick with them in that moment. And so I think when he told that story, I was like, you’re in like you’re in ice creams where you wait for the guy you beat.

00:13:14:17 – 00:13:21:13

Zack Oates

He didn’t just say, like, oh, you got $10,000 deposit. You’re in. You mean you actually care about your franchisees? Oh my gosh, now how about.

00:13:21:17 – 00:13:44:12

Jennifer Schuler

That time on that piece? Yeah, that piece is a lot. And if I don’t hear it from someone, it doesn’t really matter. The capital that’s there, it’s you know, we’re not going to fit. There’s not a values alignment between us and them. And so that’s I think the first thing that we’re listening for. And then I think the second thing, I think we do a good job of measuring it internally.

00:13:44:12 – 00:14:03:22

Jennifer Schuler

And I want to get better at building the tactics. So on the measuring side, we are pretty adamant about, if you look at us across like kind of global Yelp, we’re about four six, which is pretty strong. And so we’re always looking at that every week. We’re showing franchisees where they are, where they’re at, what their most recent reviews were, so they can understand where the gaps are and tighten that up.

00:14:03:24 – 00:14:26:04

Jennifer Schuler

I want to get better at the tactical piece, like, you know, beyond just like the emotions, finding people who are naturally drawn to it, but the tactical side, because I really think we can be like the equivalent of like a wine sommelier at a restaurant for ice cream, you know, like for when people come in and you’ve got like 48 different flavors, it’s your first time at handles, like, why are you here?

00:14:26:04 – 00:14:43:13

Jennifer Schuler

What are you celebrating? You get a sticker because it’s your first visit LA Disneyland experience. And then you get someone who’s so pumped and so proud of the ice cream and the craftsmanship that goes behind it, that they sit with you and spend time like, well, tell me what you’re into. Like, oh, you’re vegan. Okay, great. Do you like more fruits or chocolates?

00:14:43:13 – 00:14:48:22

Jennifer Schuler

Have you tried this and that? We can build even more experiential approach to it.

00:14:48:24 – 00:14:55:17

Zack Oates

I love that it’s so powerful because everyone’s saying people aren’t spending as much, and that’s true. But what?

00:14:55:17 – 00:14:57:13

Jennifer Schuler

They are spending an ice cream. Zach.

00:14:57:14 – 00:14:58:06

Zack Oates

Oh.

00:14:58:08 – 00:15:18:20

Jennifer Schuler

Seriously? Because we are so committed to generous portions and very conservative on our price increases, like we look at in and out, like they’re in a world where everything is shrinking. You’re not seeing that shrinking like your fries are overloaded and they’re very cautious about the price points, the price increases they take. And that’s when you’re a brand that’s trying to be multigenerational.

00:15:18:20 – 00:15:29:10

Jennifer Schuler

That’s the way you have to think. And I think guests reward you time and time again with their loyalty. So we are actually having a find it like on a sales performance. Phenomenal 2020.

00:15:29:10 – 00:15:49:06

Zack Oates

Three. And that’s incredible because if you a lot of people say, I want to join a nostalgic brand, they’re not thinking, I need to build a nostalgic brand, right? Because the people that you’re serving today, are they going to be the people that are going to bring their grandkids in and their kids? And I think that if you think of every day today, we are building a nostalgic brand.

00:15:49:08 – 00:16:06:24

Zack Oates

That’s how you get there. You don’t get there by just like buying a brand that’s 80 years old, or that just being like, hey, we’ve always been around like it’s it’s about doing those little things consistently. So yeah, Jennifer, this has been such a great conversation. Last question, who is someone that we should follow? Who? Someone that deserves innovation.

00:16:07:01 – 00:16:29:14

Jennifer Schuler

Okay. In the restaurant space there’s a chef that I follow. Her name is Molly Bass, and I think of food trends like food as fashion in many ways like it. You know, it trends over time. And I think she generationally is hitting on the type of the food trends of the way people are and flavor combos and the way people are going to want to eat over the next decade.

00:16:29:16 – 00:16:57:23

Jennifer Schuler

And I think it’s the foods, but also the way it’s plated, like not so fussy, very approachable, but still elevated. And this like, she just has a really nice job of flavor balance, sweet and salty, where it’s unexpected and using unexpected and surprising ingredients in a way that merge really nicely. So anyway, I always love looking at what she’s doing because I think it informs us when we can give out new flavor development.

00:16:58:00 – 00:17:12:20

Zack Oates

I love that, and not being afraid to try new things I think is great. I mean, I actually just two days ago or yesterday, I went to a Jeff’s Bagel run and I had a salt and rosemary bagel with brown sugar cream cheese. And it was like.

00:17:12:20 – 00:17:14:10

Jennifer Schuler

That’s exactly what I’m talking about.

00:17:14:10 – 00:17:23:09

Zack Oates

Right? And I’m like, what did I just like the first bite? I was like, I don’t know about this. And then by the time I was done, I was like, man, I should have gotten two.

00:17:23:11 – 00:17:45:15

Jennifer Schuler

Because it’s almost like you had that sweet, you had that salty, you had the herbs versus maybe. Yeah. And it’s like that flavor balance. I think it’s actually more common in Japanese type cuisine where there’s like these sweet, salty we find when we do that, it’s a really magical pairing. So like at a very when we bring that down to our level at handles, where we try to have flavors that are very approachable.

00:17:45:16 – 00:18:05:13

Jennifer Schuler

A time honored. We launched a product last year that did phenomenally well, is now going to become, full time. I believe it’s called Not Your Average Dough. And what was different about it was the ice cream was swirled with a salted pretzel ripple that cut some of the sweet elements of the cookie dough in there. And like, it’s exactly like you said, like that combination.

00:18:05:13 – 00:18:08:08

Jennifer Schuler

You’re like, ooh, like it just it’s very,

00:18:08:10 – 00:18:13:15

Zack Oates

I can’t imagine where you had the idea of pretzels. That’s how fast.

00:18:13:17 – 00:18:17:10

Jennifer Schuler

I started a jet team. This is a flavor team I did.

00:18:17:12 – 00:18:22:01

Zack Oates

Everybody’s like, I can’t believe they got it approved there. Wow. I didn’t even.

00:18:22:01 – 00:18:23:07

Jennifer Schuler

Think about that until now.

00:18:23:10 – 00:18:28:15

Zack Oates

That’s so funny. Anyway, it’s so fun. Well, Jennifer, how did people find and follow you? And handles.

00:18:28:17 – 00:18:37:03

Jennifer Schuler

I would say for handles, personally, the best way to find us is like Instagram or online. But even better I would say is come visit us online.

00:18:37:08 – 00:18:54:09

Zack Oates

Yeah, there you go. Jennifer. Such a great conversation. And for teaching us how to blend different flavors to create a great guest experience, and for making all Harvard alumni jealous they didn’t go to Stanford. Today’s ovation goes to you. Thank you for joining us. I give an ovation.

00:18:54:11 – 00:18:58:01

Jennifer Schuler

Awesome. Thanks. Zach is so nice. I enjoyed the conversation.

00:18:58:03 – 00:19:20:15

Zack Oates

Thanks for joining us today. If you like this episode, leave us a review on Apple Podcasts or your favorite place to listen. We’re all about feedback here. Again, this episode was sponsored by ovation, a two question, SMS based, actionable guest feedback platform built for multi-unit restaurants. If you’d like to learn how we can help you measure and create a better guest experience, visit us at ovation up.com.